Weekly Anime Discussion - You bet your ass there's spoilers

So Episode N has its own opening and it's pretty freaking badass. Charizard out of nowhere still feels really weird though. Actually, this whole arc feels kinda surreal. It's kinda like an OVA but not really. Speaking of which, since Genesect is somehow involved in Plasma's plans, could this be the first case in which events in the anime actually lead up to a movie?

The movies have always been rather vague as to whether or not they're actually canon, save for a couple who are offhandedly mentioned in the anime (like James referencing the 2000 movie and the fact that Ash knows what Aura is because of Movie 8 ) For the anime to come out and say that a movie is actually very much canon and for it's plot to be related to events that already occured in the anime is...odd. It's not really that big a revelation but it does feel strange xD

I can't get that interested in seeing Charizard yet again, its come back so many times now that the impact is lost a bit. Then again when you realize Charizard's last appearance was back in 2006 when AG ended, and that was 7 years ago....yeah, I guess it has been a long time since Charizard appeared.

I'm just hoping we see Ash's other older Pokemon too. We know when the 6th gen begins they'll go back to the "clean slate" routine and Ash won't use any older pokemon till after the league again, so the next 8 months are really the only chance to see Ash's older pokes for the time being.

On an interesting note this is the first time a generation has gone without any of Ash's older friends appearing in the opening. It seems like Dawn was the only older friend to get a guest appearance this gen, its safe to say we won't see anyone else. This will also make the second full generation where Misty did not appear at all, (since she didn't appear in the DP series at all either), so I guess its safe to say the writers don't want to bring her up anymore. Can't say I'm surprised, they're been purposely phasing her out for a long time now, and I guess the same will happen to May and Brock as well.

I'm hoping we see some of Ash's older Pokemon too. I would like to see some of the more unappreciated Pokemon he has like Glalie, Kingler and Tauros. I would like to see Squirtle and possibly Pidgeot make a return.

Also if they bring Max back or Ash gets an abandoned and abused Fennekin then they really need to get new people writing the anime.

[Linkachu]

I finally watched the last episode of the Unova League...

Worst. League. Ever. :P

Even the Indigo League was better than the mess that was Unova's league, and that's saying something! I liked Ash's battle with Kenyan but his match with Kotetsu only became entertaining closer to the end. Both Ash and Kotetsu made so many dumb choices during that battle... Leaving an already injured Pignite in against a Samurott? Really? Oh, Ash. You suck compared to Sinnoh Ash. I hope Ash of the past travels through time and slaps you upside the head.

Trip is easily the worst reoccurring rival that the Anime series as ever seen. The writers did a horrible job with him. XD To make matters worse, you can't even be proud of Ash beating Trip because his victory was so dang ridiculous. Pikachu's final attack combo was pretty nifty visually but that's as far as it went. Just another fine example of godmoding Pikachu and its ridiculously varying defensive abilities. As the rival who kept kicking Ash's ass throughout the saga, albeit a pretty bland character, Trip deserved much better than he got.

Others have already said it, but the Unova league felt rushed and unimportant. They really should have reworked the timeline and held the league at the end of the Unova saga verses directly before a major mini-arc. It was difficult to get too excited about the league episodes when I was already well aware of what was to come next. Even Ash's reason for not heading directly home after the league this time, which he alwaaaaaaays does, felt contrived. I can only hope that the final few Unova region episodes are worthy of being this saga's finale.

The Unova league was horrible, and I don't understand why they had Ash regress in rank for the first time ever.

Ash only came in Top 8 in the Unova league, whereas in the Sinnoh league he came in Top 4. He also lost to a guy with all legendaries back then, whereas here he just lost to some random idiot trainer who was a lot like Morrisson from the Hoenn league. Plus why did they have him lose to a Lucario, an old 4th gen Pokemon that they advertised to death back in the day?

And his Unova team was really poorly trained. Ash having two unevolved starters in the league reminds me of the Kanto/Johto era.

This is actually the first time in the series Ash has actually gotten WORSE as a trainer, whereas before he was gradually improving from one saga to the next.

[Linkachu]

Ash only came in Top 8 in the Unova league, whereas in the Sinnoh league he came in Top 4. He also lost to a guy with all legendaries back then, whereas here he just lost to some random idiot trainer who was a lot like Morrisson from the Hoenn league. Plus why did they have him lose to a Lucario, an old 4th gen Pokemon that they advertised to death back in the day?

The fact that Ash had 6 Pokemon and Kotetsu only had 5 really hits home how much Ash has regressed, too. So much facepalm with that league... XD

[Demelza]

It featured the Eeveelutions, BEST. LEAGUE. EVER

Yeaaaaah, no. That certainly wasn't a league to be proud of, or one we'll be remembering in a few years time. The early matches weren't interesting enough and having Ash battle his rival 1 on 1 was really, really dumb, and honestly I only really got into it when it was Pikachu vs Lucario at the end, because up until then that battle wasn't the greatest. I'd much rather Ash won that battle and then faced the Eeveelution team, and surely that would have made more sense because they'd be putting even more attention on them if they beat Ash.

I think I'm more annoyed by it because I always look forward to Ash's Gym Battles and the Leagues the most. I knew it wouldn't be the best purely because of Ash's under evolved team, but they really did rush it and it wasn't treated anywhere near as importantly as normal. Disappointed, the N arc better make up for it.

This is why I've lost a lot of interest in the Best Wishes arc. It started out like it was going to be awesome but just reset Ash's character, gave him lackluster pokemon, a terrible rival, and pretty much did away with the sense of plot/battles that DP had.

I hope the upcoming N arc turns out well, because otherwise Best Wishes is one of the weakest arcs of the show since Johto and that's saying a lot.

Is it just me, or are the writers purposely trying to give Ash's starter/starter that evolves some advantage over his rival? I kind of noticed that Gary's first Pokemon, a Blastoise (though not revealed til wayyyyyy later), a water type is weak against Ash's starter, Pikachu (though I'll give them credit for Charizard); in Sinnoh, Paul had Torterra, and while Ash also had Torterra, I think we can all agree that the main starter with the most focus was Infernape, a fire type. Then we see almost the same pattern in Best Wishes, where Trip gets a Snivy that evolves into Serperior, and Ash evolves his Tepig into a Pignite. I don't know if this is intentional, but I think this is an annoying trend. In the games, your rival is supposed to have the stronger type to your starter. Technically, I guess Gen. 1 (though technically gen 2 since this is where it was revealed) got it right since Ash's Charmander was the one that fully evolved, but, to me, it deviates more from the games than it should.

In all honesty, I think we can predict that Ash will either catch Fennekin or Chespin (or both) and evolve either in the Gen VI anime. However, they need to fix up his team variations. Sinnoh Saga was just amazing because they actually tried to give him a pretty fearsome team, but in my opinion, they can go several steps further. In the Battle Frontier Saga, I think I'm not the only one who felt slightly uncomfortable when Ash lacked a fire type on his team, but this isn't necessarily a bad thing. What I'm getting to is this: Do what they did in Sinnoh, where they actually evolved Ash's Pokemon (most of them anyway), but also mess around with the generic team formula he seems to have (Pikachu+grass starter+fire type (or starter)+water type (or starter)+generic bird+random). For instance, they could try something like Pikachu+Froakie (because he needs a fully evolved water starter dammit)+ground+fighting+dragon+psychic or whatever. Maybe not those specific types, but you know, something different...which I know is as likely as Pikachu devolving into a Magikarp, but I digress.

Also, even though I know it's less likely, I would love to see Ash actually take on an E4 member and win. I mean, it's guaranteed that he'll never win the championship (which Sinnoh proved by god modding Tobias and Unova proved by lowering their standards for good writing), but I think that would just be pretty cool for him to do. Or actually make a companion an E4 member (though I guess Iris took the cake for being the 8th gym leader/Champion of Unova).

However, what will happen is that Ash will capture Chespin, Fennekin, and Froakie, evolve Chespin or Fennekin, capture generic bird, evolve it, capture some random mons, gain a rival who will have a Pokemon starter that is weaker to the one that Ash evolves, get two useless companions: one at least being a gym leader or being the female protagonist of the games and the other being either a reoccurring character or another gym leader, both with bland personalities, win all 8 badges, and then lose the first match of the XY Pokemon League because they decided to evolve his Pokemon after the league arc and they are horribly under powered, oh, and lose to a man with a a Sylveon. Hell, why not let him lose to a preschooler with an enduring and endeavering Starly? Or to a mysterious man with both Xerneas and Ylveltal on his team?

Sorry...I got frustrated and began to get a little angry with Ash. I really, REALLY wish that they would replace him with somebody that COULD win the championship, such as the main protagonist of the game, which the anime is supposed to be based off of, where they actually follow the guidelines of the game and have said trainer's team at a certain point by a certain town or badge (example, most of us are able to have our starter or another Pokemon evolved by the 2nd to third gym, correct?) instead of waiting 6 badges in to evolve an already underpowered starter. How about somebody that actually has rivals, and can travel by himself?

But again, Ash will go to the new region, 10 years old once again, completely fumble and folly, and wind up wondering why he can't win the league even though he doesn't put in enough effort, with the same generic underleveled/underevolved team. whoops I need to stop ranting

[Linkachu]

Sorry...I got frustrated and began to get a little angry with Ash. I really, REALLY wish that they would replace him with somebody that COULD win the championship

I often wonder why people feel this way, as if to assume that a protagonist other than Ash would be able to accomplish feats that Ash can't. Even if it'd be a different character, with different Pokemon, and a different personality, they'd still be hindered by the choices of the writing staff. They don't want Ash to win a league championship because they have no idea where they would take the show from there. Such a situation would be exactly the same with any other long running hero too unless the show completely changed its focus - less time spent on the gym badges/league competition and more time spent on varying plot-lines and character developments.

Ash isn't the problem. The way the show is written and handled is the issue. If they finally decided to retire Ash and co. after the next saga we'd likely see him finally go all the way and win the championship, beat the Elite 4, and so on, but there's no way they're going to do that while the show is still profitable. A new hero means a new start; there's always the risk that they could lose viewers in the process. It's a risk that they don't appear to be willing to take either. The best we could hope for would be spin-off shows or OVAs starring new characters and lord knows if the makers would ever seriously consider such at this point. They've had ages to do something more with the Pokemon universe and the best we've ever received Anime-wise was the Raikou Special and the B2/W2 Anime trailers. :/

Each new saga is aimed at new kids. The writers don't have to worry about losing viewers from a previous arc when they will have outgrown the show.

For example I don't think all the kids who started watching DP as their first saga are still watching Best Wishes. And those kids had to say goodbye to Dawn/Piplup as to them she was the only female protagonist they ever knew. Those of us older fans who were watching back when Misty and May were on the show are the minority, very few older fans kept up with the entire run of the anime.

I would like to see Ash's story wrapped up even if its unlikely. Just so the anime could have a sense of closure.

[Linkachu]

Each new saga is aimed at new kids. The writers don't have to worry about losing viewers from a previous arc when they will have outgrown the show.

For example I don't think all the kids who started watching DP as their first saga are still watching Best Wishes. And those kids had to say goodbye to Dawn/Piplup as to them she was the only female protagonist they ever knew. Those of us older fans who were watching back when Misty and May were on the show are the minority, very few older fans kept up with the entire run of the anime.

Thing is, that IS one of the main reasons why they haven't axed Ash and Pikachu yet. I'd say you're assuming far too much with their viewership too. After all, they're bringing back Ash's Charizard again for a reason. They know full well that Charizard's a fan favourite, and who are the viewers who appreciate it most? Oldschool fans. Then we have to consider the Sinnoh league, which was as much about Ash's new Pokemon as it was his old ones. An educated guess would say that the creators are well aware of the series' legacy, and just because a fan is newer doesn't mean that they wouldn't return to older seasons and watch through them too. That's likely why Pokemon TV exists.

Dawn may have been an important character to the Sinnoh arc but that's all she was. Ash and Pikachu are the main characters, and Pikachu alone - Ash's Pikachu no less - is basically the mascot of the franchise now. I wouldn't count on either of them being replaced anytime soon, nor should anyone expect such really.

Thing is, that IS one of the main reasons why they haven't axed Ash and Pikachu yet. I'd say you're assuming far too much with their viewership too. After all, they're bringing back Ash's Charizard again for a reason. They know full well that Charizard's a fan favourite, and who are the viewers who appreciate it most? Oldschool fans. Then we have to consider the Sinnoh league, which was as much about Ash's new Pokemon as it was his old ones. An educated guess would say that the creators are well aware of the series' legacy, and just because a fan is newer doesn't mean that they wouldn't return to older seasons and watch through them too. That's likely why Pokemon TV exists.

The thing is the actual Pokemon like Charizard or Mewtwo are popular also because of the games. So even if the kids watching Best Wishes never saw Kanto, it doesn't really matter, they just see these cool Pokemon from the games.

As for older fans, people drift in and out of the series. Its true a lot of us continued watching into AG and DP, but a lot didn't. We're now 16 years into the series, so most of us who were young when Kanto was airing grew up, went to College, and became adults. Not everyone watched through the entire show because they either lost interest or just didn't have time to watch Pokemon anymore. This is why character returns ARE brief and only a select few older characters come back each saga, instead of everyone.

Dawn may have been an important character to the Sinnoh arc but that's all she was. Ash and Pikachu are the main characters, and Pikachu alone - Ash's Pikachu no less - is basically the mascot of the franchise now. I wouldn't count on either of them being replaced anytime soon, nor should anyone expect such really.

Agreed. I know they won't drop Ash, as much as I think its time for him to be wrapped up, especially with the way Best Wishes is actually regressing him and making him weaker than he was in DP, which makes no sense.

This is the first saga where Ash was actually noticeably weaker or a worse trainer than a previous arc. Its actually really disturbing for those of us who watched DP to see what the writers did to him this series.

[Linkachu]

The thing is the actual Pokemon like Charizard or Mewtwo are popular also because of the games. So even if the kids watching Best Wishes never saw Kanto, it doesn't really matter, they just see these cool Pokemon from the games.

If that were true, why not just bring any ol' Charizard into the season?

Nah, Charizard has always been a fan favourite and they know it. We all know it. It has to be that Charizard because that's the one people love. And, yeah, Pokemon TV allows current gen fans to rewatch the older generations. My younger sisters may have gotten into the Anime series late but that sure as heck didn't stop them from going riiiiiiight back to the start and watching a crap load of the series - multiple times over at that - so they know all about Ash's Charizard and love the thing too. XD

A new hero doesn't have that legacy. It's within the same world but they'd literally be starting over from square one when Ash could be rebooted a hundred times over and still keep his history. Even the movies, which span Ash's lengthy adventure, are still meaningful to newer fans simply because they're based on Ash and Pikachu, characters they know and love. If they swapped out to a new hero that wouldn't be true anymore. I could keep throwing out points like this but the bottom line is that it's much, much safer for a creator to monopolize on current ideas than to break away with something completely brand new. I can't speak for you, but to me it makes a lot of sense.

This is why character returns ARE brief and only a select few older characters come back each saga, instead of everyone.

I'd personally feel that character returns are brief because they're older characters; they've already had their time to shine. What's come and gone can be appreciated while still promoting what's new, and that's ultimately the central focus of the series (promote the new Pokemon, new region, and new characters while giving enough back to older fans to keep 'em happy). It's a balance and, if I'm fair, I'd say the show has always done quite a good job at it - at least as far as Ash's Pokemon go. Time will tell if the likes of Misty and Brock ever make brief cameos again.

Charizard got a pretty good return episode, even if it just felt like fanservice pandering to old fans.

I didn't care much for the redrawn Kanto scenes myself, even if it was a nostalgia trip. I also noticed they purposely didn't show the battles of Charizard Vs. Blaziken or against Brandon's Dusclops. Is it because they were Hoenn Pokemon and they only wanted to show Charizard against Kanto pokemon?

[Linkachu]

Yay, someone finally replied again. :'D

I'm really enjoying the N arc so far. That new opening, aw man, I've watched it over and over and still love it to pieces. All of the episodes that I've watched so far have been good too. I was already a massive N fanwhore to begin with but now he's easily my favourite character within the entirety of the franchise (sorry Cynthia). They should boot Ash and make a new series starring N. *Sagely nods*

I think RX linked to the new opening awhile ago, but I'm doing so again because it's just that awesome. |D

After the N saga closes they're doing another island hopping filler arc till X and Y, somewhat similar to Orange Islands although there's no new Gyms this time.

I'm sure some people have seen the poster image advertising it on Bulbanews or Serebii, but it also strongly implies both Iris and Cilan are leaving at the end of the arc, with a "sayonara" under their characters waving farewell.

Bit sad that Cilan is leaving so soon if it is true, I was hoping he's stay for another generation like Brock did. As for Iris her whole character has been rather unpopular, so I don't really care on that front. Misty has never been a good character past Orange Islands, (I don't think anyone needs to be reminded why people didn't like her during Johto) but Iris actually made me appreciate her a bit more in retrospect, even if Iris battles much more and has better pokemon.

Actually hoping they go back to the female protagonist co-star set-up next gen. I'd rather another May/Dawn type character than another Misty/Iris one next gen.

Well I'm going to go out on a limb now, and suggest that the new arc will have ash catch an old pokémon, that will have a new evolution in X and Y. Sure they did it with Aipom, and Poliwag (ok Misty caught poliwag but shhh), but as we know, they love repeating plotlines in Pokémon.
You all called me crazy when I suggested it with Aipom, and boom, Ambipom! Well I'm calling it now, just so any old pokémon that appear in the series you're going to be going "omg, are they giving <enter pokémon here> an evolution....?" thusly I will ruin all enjoyment of the new series purely because you'll be questioning everything you see.

Back in focus, yay Cilan is leaving! I know there are a lot of cilan fans out there, but he's just never sat right with me, kinda douchey, flambouyant, and pansage is lame. I do wonder if Ash will once again be travelling with gym leaders. Goddamn why can't nintendo show us at least the first 2 new gym leaders so we can decide if they should be travelling companions or not =P I just hope we don't have another Max....

I just watched the dub of Ash's battle with Cameron.

I don't think it was that bad a battle, and I don't mind Ash losing to Cameron. What I do mind, however, is that Ash doesn't win a single full battle in the whole tournament. It just feels really rushed in general, with the Trip battle being 1v1. He's the main bloody rival!

I think the X and Y saga may return to mixing things up somewhat like in Sinnoh. It's so linked with past regions that I can't see Ash trying to win with just his regional Pokémon when it comes to the Pokémon league, and I wouldn't be surprised if one of his Pokémon gets an evolution in Gen VI and he brings it with him (like with Aipom).

I'm not too bothered about the possibility of Iris and Cilan leaving. Cilan's constant food-based analogies are really grating, and Iris doesn't do much anyway. I don't think we'll see Brock return - he seems to have been retired. I'm hoping they change the formula slightly, like in Hoenn, and have more than two companions.

The island saga looks quite interesting, if only because it's reintroducing older characters, such as Clair. Still, if every episode is a filler and there is no real aim, it could become pretty boring.

I think people like Cilan simply because Brock became SO STALE in DP, and he's better than Tracey or Max were. Also people like the more flamboyant nature of Cilan's character. However I agree classic Brock (pre Sinnoh) was the best male sidekick.

I'd say:

Kanto-AG Brock > Cilan > Tracey > DP Brock > Max

Brock was just boring in DP, which is probably why Cilan became popular because he was such a change of pace.